Bulletin Board
Part Two

A note from the Webmaster: The messages on this page have been culled from various newgroups. Seth Sicroff, Webmaster

Bulletin Board, Part One
Bulletin Board, Part Three
Bulletin Board, Part Four
Bulletin Board, Part Five
Bulletin Board, Part Six
Home

Cardiomyopathy in Boxers

Any other boxer owners treating their boxer for Cardiomyopathy? Was wondering what has worked and what has not. I have been treating our male for almost three years. So far we are pleased (we still have him) but it has been expensive. claymore@STOPSPAMhome.com on June 6, 1998
POSTED ON "rec.pets.dogs.breeds"

COMMENT posted by "revscot"

Are heart problems common in Boxers? Our neighbors had two extremely healthy, happy boxers. Came home one day and one of them had just unexpectedly died. The vet deduced it was a heart attack... Is this common?

COMMENT posted by CMCK, cmck@jps.net

Unfortunately, yes. Boxers succumb to Cardiomyopathy (enlargement of the heart) and Cancer at roughly 4 times the rate of most breeds.

COMMENT posted by ObedBOXER

The College of Veterinary Medicine at Ohio State University is doing research on Boxer Cardiomyopathy (CM).

The study involves a 24 hour holter monitor and some DNA (via blood sample) testing. Owners wishing to have their boxers participate in the OSU project should contact Dr. Kate Meurs at OSU. Additional infomation is available on the web page depicting the placement of the leads for the OSU study. Please consider participation in this important research.

COMMENT posted by Susan Bendziewicz, webmaster, OSU Boxer CM Web Page, ObedBOXER

As CMCK suggested, dogs intending to be bred should be deemed "CM clear" via the 24 hour holter, prior to being used for breeding, as there is a genetic component to Boxer CM.

Please feel free to contact me VIA EMAIL, if you desire additional information RE: OSU Boxer CM research.

COMMENT posted by Dagmar, dschouten@ovcnet.uoguelph.ca

Yes, unfortunately heart problems are a problem of the breed. Cardiomyopathy in boxers is often hard to diagnose but a lot of boxers have episodes of collapse before they may die from the condition.

My older (6 year old) boxer is suspected of having cardiomyopathy--he collapsed 4 years ago now and he has had a couple of small episodes since. He is the best dog in the world and I can't bear the thought of losing him but I guess if he doesn't suffer (it doesn't seem like he is aware when he collapses) then it's better than if he was in pain.

Anyways, 6 GREAT years with this dog have been closer to my heart than 14 with the dachshund I grew up with (although I loved him dearly).

COMMENT posted by kassa@delphi.com

A clarification. While cardiomyopathy is indeed an enlargement of the heart, Boxer Cardiomyopathy is a horse of a different color, and more of an arhythmia problem, which is why echoes are virtually useless in this condition (unlike traditional cardiomyopathy). The only real screening tool for it now is a 24 hour Holter monitor, which is a 24 hr ECG.

As for cancer, the best bet is to know the lines well, and not cross lines that both carry cancer. For some reason, while boxers do have a high rate of cancer, they do not tend to die of it to the extent or at the rate that other breeds do. They're more likely to get it, but more likely to live longer with the same condition.

(And never ever believe a breeder who says they don't have both in their lines *somewhere*)

COMMENT posted by cmck@jps.net wrote

Boxers succumb to Cardiomyopathy (enlargement of the heart) and Cancer at roughly 4 times the rate of most breeds. For those reasons, its really important to research your breeder. Responsible breeders should, besides the more common tests for Dysplasia etc, be doing specific testing and liniage research for cancer, and Holter testing for CM.

Feline Cardiomyopathy

In November my cat began coughing (at the time I didn't know what it was, something between trying to throw up and a cough). I took her to the vet and he listened to her lungs and said she had some fluid in her left lung and a touch of bronchitis. He took an X-ray and it was clear. He put her on an antibiotic and lasix. This worked, I took her back in about a month and her lungs were clear. In April the coughing returned. Back to the vet. He again listened to her lungs and said she had a little fluid in her left lung AGAIN. Back on lasix and the coughing went away, but he had no idea what was causing it. She has once again began coughing and she is back on lasix for the third time in 7 months. My (her) vet still has no idea what is causing fluid in her left lung.

Has ANYONE ever seen or heard of this problem before? Does anyone have any idea or even a guess (I'll even settle for a wild guess) as to what could be causing this problem? Any and all replies would be much appreciated. The vet can continue to treat the symptoms but the until the cause is found it may not work every time.
thank you,
John and Tino
john mcmanus
gopokes@worldnet.att.net POSTED on "alt.animals.felines.diseases"

COMMENT BY HJS, DVM (sherwohj@olypen.com)

Well a cardiac ultrasound to check for cardiomyopathy might be a good place to start. A thyroid check for hyperthyroid would be nice also. A parasite check for lungworms could prove helpfull, cats can pick them up. Another possibility could be heartworms, that would depend on where you live. Cats in addition to dogs can develop problems with heartworms.

Due to the lack of a patient, client, professional relationship, this information is offered as general advice, rather than a specific professional diagnosis, prognosis or treatment recomendation.
Good luck,
HJS DVM sherwohj@olypen.com FOLLOW-UP BY JOHN MCMANUS

Thank you for your reply. Since my original post I have done some reading and have talked to some people and it seems she may have left side congenital heart failure. She will be 13 this Fall. I have no idea how long she can live with this ailment. I have put her on Hill's H/D food at least while she is on the lasix.

Thank you again, John and Tino

SSDI Eligibility

Can someone direct me to the guidelines that tell me how bad someone has to be with DCM before they are eligible for SSDI for themselves and their dependents?
thanks
sue
jgracya319@aol.com
(green bay, wi)
(asking for my brother who is in Washington state)
POSTED on "alt.government.ssdi-benefits" on May 10, 1998

COMMENT BY Karen Kording (karenk@muscanet.com
I can't give you specifics but what you need to find is the listing of impairments. I also have cardiomyopathy and was denied twice before finally being approved. But my approval was based on a combination of medical conditions.
Karen

"Caved-In Chest"

My boss was diagnosed with cardiomyopathy and blocked arteries several months ago. He is also a diabetic. He underwent quadruple bypass surgery 4 months ago. He went to all his post operative appointments and progressed normally except for an infection at the site on his leg where the vein was removed for the bypass. He has no insurance, and has cancelled subsequent appointments, such as a repeat heart echo that was scheduled, because of financial problems.

His wife asked me to post a question and see if we could get some responses and some information. His chest, where his ribs were spread for the bypass, is sort of concaved in, and she is concerned about this. She feels that he went back to work too soon after the surgery and pushes himself too much, lifts too much, etc.

To a certain degree, from my observations, she's right. He is just a very "controlling" individual and has to have everything his way. He simply refuses to admit that he has limits and he feels that his body is rebelling against him.

Any information on cardiomyopathy or the matter of the caved-in appearance of his chest would be much appreciated.

POSTED May 25, 1998 on "flora.ask-doctor"
(This forum is also carried ON THE WEB at http://www.flora.org/ask-doctor/)

COMMENT BY A. VAN BEVEREN, PH.D., C.N.C.
There are several relationships between diabetes and CVHD but the one that "jumps" out from everywhere is hypochromia. The list of all the things that can cause chromiuria is impressive but what is most remarkable is that the crystallized sugar consumption in the USA has jumped from less than 112 lbs per year per person to 149.9 pounds per year per person. Signs and symptoms of chromium deficiency include impaired glucose tolerance, fasting hyperglycemia, glycosuria, hypoglycemia, elevated circulating insulin, decreased number of insulin receptors, (and therefore binding), reduced lean body mass, elevated % of body fat, increased ocular pressure, peripheral neuropathy, encephalopathy, low repsiratory quotient and abnormal nitrogen balance. Chromium has a wide therapeutic index and has been used in large doses without toxicity. It is most prevalent in Black-strap molassis, brewers' yeast, Marmite, Stevia and other high Vitamin B foods.

COMMENT BY BILL CHAN, D.C.
What your boss had is type A personality, coupled with heart and diabetic! Being controlling, and doing it " My way" is definitely not going to help his predicament! Some will never listen. Whenever people do not listen his blood pressure shoot up! Even in the most ideal situation a Cardiologist sittimg next to him all day will not help! Tell him to wake up and smell the coffee! ( do not drink it either) He has to change his life style inorder to gain benefit from all these medical treatments! The truth hurts!

PLEASE NOTE: the information contained on this system is not intended to supplant individual professional consultation. It is offered solely as a community education service. Advice on individual problems should be obtained directly from a professional. FOLLOW-UP: we would appreciate a follow-up note to let us know how things worked out for you. Submit it in the same way you submit your question.

Young cat with heart Murmur

If it's a male cat with a heart murmur, she should have an EKG done, because a heart murmur can be (but not always) a sign of cardiomyopathy, which is the leading cause of sudden death in cats. I just lost my Dudley 3 weeks ago to this awful disease, but it was asymptomatic (still in its very early stages). Anyway, sometimes its genetic and sometimes it's a result of taurine deficiency, and is more prevalent in males than in females. It's completely cureable if it's caused by tauring deficiency.
Margie
margiewa@sfsu.edu
POSTED on "rec.pets.cats.health+behav" on June 5, 1998.

COMMENT BY Aaron Blosser blosser@remove.this.ix.netcom.com
I had an experience with my cat about a year ago. He was having trouble urinating and turned out he had a blockage.
After being treated for the blockage with a catheter, he began having trouble breathing.
Turns out the blockaged caused enough stress that he had a tricuspid valve regurgitation. Seemed he had a heart problem all along, but the blockage and it's stress and trauma caused the heart failure.
He had excess fluid around his heart, preventing his lungs from fully expanding.
He's now fine (after a VERY expensive bill) and takes a diuretic (Lasix) once a day to keep the fluids from building up.
Very scary, and very serious. Only an EKG could show this, and while it's expensive to get done, early detection will keep the costs from being greater if your cat actually has a heart failure.

Canine Cardiac Dysfunction

I have a 2 year old dobe that displayed right side enlargement at 8 months old. An echo at the time showed no cardiac dysfunction, except for an expulsion rate that ran just slightly above the high normal parameter.

He has had some bouts of syncope at 8 mos, to which the cardiologist attempted to explain away as a sort of "K9 Reynaud's Syndrome".

He now has a slight murmur on ausculatation and some a very slight "huffing" after excercise. He had one episode of fainting since his last cardio exam.

I'm taking him in for another echo soon but I'm wondering if this is a futile effort. I know that I am looking forward to some pretty expensive meds but is there any other alternatives. I know he's quite young but this seems to be advancing a lot quicker than my other dobe. I was expecting her to develop cardiomyopathy, as all dobes seem to, but, she's is 5 years old and showing no signs.

Any suggestions are welcome. At this point, so is speculation.
Harry Kemerton
hrb4254@acs.tamu.edu
POSTED May 26, 1998, on "alt.med.veterinary"

Posted Response:

Is he on any ace inhibitors like Enacard? Digitalis is usually also used in conjunction for dilated cardiomyopathy along with Lasix and K supplementation. It definitely helps and you might want to consider starting him on this medical therapy depending on the severity of the condition.
hrb4254@acs.tamu.edu

Feline "Mixed Cardiomyopathy"?

My cat Timmy had congestive heart failure on New Year's Eve. After a number of tests, including an ultrasound, they determined that he had dilated cardiomyopathy related to his diet. He's been getting taurine supplements, Enacard, and Lasix since then and really perked up, becoming more bouncy than he's been in years. The congestion was gone, and the vet said his heart was beating faster, and he put on some weight. We cut down on the medications about a month ago, and since then he's gotten a little worse--just kind of cranky and not so bouncy, but still eating plenty and gaining weight. I took him back to the vet last week and she said his heart sounded the best it ever had.

Today I took him for an ultrasound, fully expecting to see major improvement. Wrong. They said there was hardly any difference. The ultrasound vet (not my regular vet) told me she thought Timmy had dilated cardiomyopathy on part of his heart and restrictive cardiomyopathy on another part. I have never heard of this, and frankly it reminded me of Groucho Marx's Dr. Hammer--"you have high blood pressure on your left side and low blood pressure on your right side." They also gouged me out of an extra $30, which didn't help my confidence any. I'm scheduled to meet with my regular vet tomorrow to go over the results, but needless to say I am very upset and worried.

Has anyone ever heard of mixed cardiomyopathy? Please help!
POSTED by Karen Hohne on "rec.pets.cats.health+behav" on May 12, 1998

COMMENT BY Hermital hermital@livingston.net
Not all that unusual in humans. Go to http://altavista.digital.com/, type in "cardiomyopathy" and research it at your leisure.
For cats, go to http://www.vetinfo.com/ccardio.html.